439 replies to this topic

[Coach Rob]

Lot's of great info. Many thanks to all of you.

We are 5 v 5, 10-12 year olds, 7 yd rush line, QB can run.

I read many articles on defense, but the one thing I haven't found is a playbook for the defense. Does anybody have one? I need specific info on zone coverages, when to release out of a zone, how to cover deep,... Thanks.

We switched to a 3 2 zone this yr. 2 up front close to the LOS to cover the run and our 3 others are 7 yds back. We number our 3 players 1,2,3 (2 is middle). The D coach stands behind the middle player and holds up 1,2 or 3 telling the players which person is rushing depending upon how the offense is lining up. We trained the non rushers to cheat and help cover the hole left by the rusher, plus keep an eye on their zone.

[cleveland john]

Hi to all. I've been lurking for a few weeks and trying to absorb as much as I can. Orange and Rob have been a great resource (as well as so many new members). We play 7-on-7 on a 60 yard field with 1st and 2nd graders. Anyone can run and all players are eligible on pass plays. Defense requires 4 on the line (3 yards off the ball) who may rush immediately.

Our first game was this weekend and we won 12-6 (but it was not that close!). We only had 2 practices before the game so my guys only "knew" 3 plays and ran them repeatedly. However, once boredom set it for them (and me) we opened things up a bit and started drawing up some plays in the dirt. I was confident in our stingy D to keep us in the game.

The flag pulling drills - especially blocking the runner with you body while swiping at the flag - were some of the best advice. The other team just ran their quarterback on every play and they only got two first downs the entire game. I also have a really BIG team. We dominated the line of scrimmage - especially on defense. The game ended with one of my first-graders sacking their quarterback 3 straight times by running right up the middle through their line. He REALLY seemed to enjoy that since he is reluctant to carry the ball. I think I might put in better blocking schemes and work on some better running plays for some of the slower players on the team - they were dead to rights on the end around we run as it took too long to develop.

If you want to see our second touchdown - check out youtube and search for nonosgrammy (but ignore the tackle clip there, my 10 year old is complaining about his Grammy posting his worst play of the entire game - a lazy block away from the play). The crazy looking kid with the headband and mouthguard is my 7-year old Bryce.

On offense, we ran the end around twice to start the game (a 7 yard gain and a fumbled handoff) then ran a center pass for a 50-yard TD. We also ran a QB keeper (I know that's not allowed in a lot of your leagues) right after the end around that worked great. My kids also liked the reverse to a wide receiver off of the end around. That one went for a 20 yard gain (down to the 10 yard line). Unfortunately we threw a pick-6 the other way on the next play (it was 12-0 with about 4 minutes to go so we went a little wacky and the kids still had fun on the turnover).

I think this week in practice we'll work on running the same plays the other direction and installing a JUMBO formation to get 3 kids on the team more touches. If we block this one, I think it will be a great short yardage play for picking up first downs, extra points or punching it in the end zone. I also have 2 kids on the team that cannot catch and struggle taking a handoff. That is the next challenge - getting them the ball in a position to be successful.

[Johnp2]

"CJ", congrats on your opening game! it sounds like your league is a bit like mine. We play 8 on 8 (8-9 year olds), and blocking is allowed. So in your league, up to four players can blitz at anytime as long as they are three yards off the line? Is that correct? That is very interesting. I guess that is why the QB can run, eh?

I'd certainly tout blocking with your players, and perhaps even design some plays that work against the blitz. Shuffle passes worked well for us last season---where players could rush (only two) after five seconds. I'd have my QB move around the pocket some "looking" for someone to throw to, and have one of my lineman (who was BLAZING fast) just stand there and look lost (kind of like he was the "slow" one on the team), then we'd simply wait for the rush. Once it came, my QB would flip it to the lineman and off he would go. I noticed this started deterring the rush some, so if they did not come after him he would simply stand there and wait until a receiver became open and then sling it, OR if they rushed but covered the lineman there was pretty much always a receiver standing there all by himself he could throw it to.

I'd think if you were playing against a team that rushed three on virtually every play, short slant passes would work as well. Do you give your QB hot reads? That would be a good idea as well. That is what I have been working with my son on (he is our QB). This season, I've learned that teams can rush, but only once every four downs. Consequently, I will probably send a receiver somewhere underneath on virtually every passing play. If the rush comes, that will be his blanket. I'm trying not to overload him with too much right now, so we'll see how that works.

Cool video clip, by the way. Hopefully I can get a parent to roll tape on our games this season. Obviously I can't, and well---have given up trying to teach the wife how to operate her cam-corder. :-)

[Orange]

Here is a good play that we're able to run this year in scrimmages. Against a 2 1 2 defense, we fake a pitch or end around right. The right wideout runs a quick flag pattern. We've been getting the corner to bite in on the fake run and the qb throws the quick flag. I probably wouldn't have tried this last year but my qbs at 9 years old can now make that throw.

[Coach Ray]

We played our first 'official' game last week against the team that 'rushed' us from the LOS when they shouldn't have been allowed in the jamboree. I discussed with the ref before the game and he was on the lookout for it.

Just like our jamboree game they won the coin flip and took the ball first. Also, just like the jamboree they scored on the very first play. I've got to figure out how to get my guys 'into it' on that first play.

On our first offensive play, I knew what I was going to run based on what they did to us last week and how they lineup (3-2 zone). I did what we call a 'quick pass' to the left. My QB takes the snap and just fires a pass out to the wideout. It was complete and he ran 45 yards for the TD. I knew they would be rushing so that is why I went with it.

We ended the game in a 12-12 tie. I had a double reverse on one play that we would have scored on during the game but it was one of my slower guys running it and they ran him down. Also, my son dropped a handoff on the another double reverse on the games final play that he would have probably scored on. Our second TD came on a center drag play that we worked to perfection.

We've done a great job with flag pulling (minus the games first play). We get in front of the runner and slow them down while pulling the flag.

We continue to struggle with handoffs and I am going to work on that more. Double reverse (double handoffs) seem to cause the defense lots of problems. Also, I plan to throw the ball a bit more this week.

In the huddle, I'm using laminated plays. We work on them during practice BUT it still seems the kids don't totally understand what they are doing and we are taking WAY TOO LONG in the huddle. Any ideas that might help me out here (run fewer plays and get good at those, etc)?

Thanks!!

[Coach Rob]

We work on them during practice BUT it still seems the kids don't totally understand what they are doing and we are taking WAY TOO LONG in the huddle. Any ideas that might help me out here (run fewer plays and get good at those, etc)?

Congrats on your first game, sounds like you guys had a chance to win that one. Regarding faster play calling in the huddle:

1) The first few games it takes a while to get in a groove calling plays. After the kids run them over and over, they will know what to do. Practice and time. We run at least 20-25 minutes of scrimmage time each practice.

2) Tell the kids they can't talk in the huddle. Can't have kids suggesting things, telling other kids what to do or jabbering.

3) Reduce the number of plays you have on the field for a series (might need to simplify some of the plays if they appear too complicated for the kids).

4) Choose the right kids for your flea flicker double whammy reverse, let the others run dummy routes on those plays.

CRob

[Coach Ray]

Thanks CRob!!

There is some talking going on in the huddle. I try to limit it to just me but there is always talk. Can I get the ball on this play? Etc. I'll try and limit that to just me going forward - starting with practice.

I think I may try and limit the # of plays as you suggest. I'll try and go with the drag passes, reverses, and double reverses (and maybe something coming from the backfield).

I do think I may have a few to many plays for them at this early stage. However, I want to have the ability to run several things. I've got to balance that and like I said, I may limit the plays we run until we get those down and then add on.

On the play calling - do you go through what EVERY player is doing on the play OR do you mainly concentrate on the responsibilities of the QB and the guys getting the ball?

[cleveland john]

After our successful debut, we have practice today and controlling expectations will be a key. I want the kids to feel confident in what we are doing, proud of their win and excited to be there, but seeing some of the kids this week you'd think we were the '72 Dolphins or something. I plan to work on flag pulling, footwork and blocking as our start. I also only have 2 centers that i trust to do our shotgun snaps. We are allowed to snap the ball sideways so i plan on working a couple guys in (we lost one of our centers last week to soccer pictures after half time and the other had to play every down).

I also have 3 players that i don't think can catch the ball and 2 that REALLY struggle taking handoffs. I have a new formation to work on that is basically a QB sweep with a lot of blocking. 3 or 4 of the guys last week were really excited about getting some contact (which really help on D as our 4-man line dominated), so we'll see how they do. Johnp2, you said you were a center? I guess this is the tackle in me coming out, but i think there are some good skills to teach - even if they only get applied on a few plays.

I also plan on adding another formation - that will give us 3 different looks that should give each player a chance to catch or run with the ball is a comfortable spot. It will also really help our run/pass mix as we will add 3 different pass plays in addition to our Center Drag (scored our first touchdown of the year on it on the second play) and TE Post patterns.

We also seemed to take forever in the huddle, but it was only our first game and everyone needed to know their job on every play. By the second half we were much better with simple marching orders for each position (block, fake handoff, run this pattern to draw the safety, etc).

[cleveland john]

"CJ", congrats on your opening game! it sounds like your league is a bit like mine. We play 8 on 8 (8-9 year olds), and blocking is allowed. So in your league, up to four players can blitz at anytime as long as they are three yards off the line? Is that correct? That is very interesting. I guess that is why the QB can run, eh?

I'd certainly tout blocking with your players, and perhaps even design some plays that work against the blitz. Shuffle passes worked well for us last season---where players could rush (only two) after five seconds. I'd have my QB move around the pocket some "looking" for someone to throw to, and have one of my lineman (who was BLAZING fast) just stand there and look lost (kind of like he was the "slow" one on the team), then we'd simply wait for the rush. Once it came, my QB would flip it to the lineman and off he would go. I noticed this started deterring the rush some, so if they did not come after him he would simply stand there and wait until a receiver became open and then sling it, OR if they rushed but covered the lineman there was pretty much always a receiver standing there all by himself he could throw it to.

I'd think if you were playing against a team that rushed three on virtually every play, short slant passes would work as well. Do you give your QB hot reads? That would be a good idea as well. That is what I have been working with my son on (he is our QB). This season, I've learned that teams can rush, but only once every four downs. Consequently, I will probably send a receiver somewhere underneath on virtually every passing play. If the rush comes, that will be his blanket. I'm trying not to overload him with too much right now, so we'll see how that works.

Cool video clip, by the way. Hopefully I can get a parent to roll tape on our games this season. Obviously I can't, and well---have given up trying to teach the wife how to operate her cam-corder. :-)

We have not worked on hot reads yet, but with coaches on the field the middle of the field is getting crowded! We ran a TE post pattern that was well covered by the other coach and his safety. (He would stand there with his safety and 'push' him in the right direction - the coach read our plays and reacted his safety). I am a bit concerned by other coach 'positioning' for a lot of our plays. I might add a flare to the TE. We are also working on a roll-out oriented pass, but so far my QBs are really anxious to throw the ball - whether the receivers are ready or not!

I may have to wait another week - we have a busy practice schedule this week already.

[Coach Rob]

On the play calling - do you go through what EVERY player is doing on the play OR do you mainly concentrate on the responsibilities of the QB and the guys getting the ball?

I start out with the main players, then tell the rest what they're doing. My plays are all color coded, so I assign each player a color for each play. So it goes something like this:

Everyone hustles back and gets behind me. "We're going to run Blue Ghost, Jim you're orange - use a shotgun snap, make it good. Bob you're QB, hand off to Erik who is blue - full speed Erik, Suzie you're green scoot way back, don't move and allow Erik enough room to come by. Tom you're red, run that route. Everyone got it?"

"We're running Stack 'Em, Fred you're orange - direct snap, make it good. Jim you're QB, roll hard to the right. Sally red, Tom blue, Jordan green, run those routes and line up way out wide near the sidelines. Jim? Tom should be open, no interceptions, if he's not open, run. Got it?"

CRob

[cleveland john]

"We're running Stack 'Em, Fred you're orange - direct snap, make it good. Jim you're QB, roll hard to the right. Sally red, Tom blue, Jordan green, run those routes and line up way out wide near the sidelines. Jim? Tom should be open, no interceptions, if he's not open, run. Got it?"

CRob
[/quote]


Rob - that sounds a lot like what I do as well (the hustle back to the huddle seems to be the challenge - although we practice our "No Walking on the Football Field" rule all the time). I worried at first about the kids getting too attached to one color. That would make getting everyone the ball a real issue since we play 7-on-7 and it has been a real struggle to get the ball in the hands of a couple positions - like our TE. There never seems to be a good spot for him to get a pass (especially with the opposing coaches gumming up the middle of the field like I mentioned above).

My advice to all (based on limited experience) is to drill it into the kids heads at practice. At practice last night, we worked on our base formation and flipped it to the right (giving us 2 formations), worked on some plays from another NEW formation (that is geared towards getting the ball in the hands of a couple players that cannot catch and are about 50/50 on handoffs) AND introduced an oddball formation just meant to mess with the other team (especially the coach - as much as I like to just line up and play, I can't get the headgames out of my gameplan). My kids are really excited by what we call Trips Left - we have a center and one OL with the QB while 3 linemen and a receiver go wide left. We only run 2 plays out of it right now - a quick pass to the WR who is to break up the sideline with 3 blockers (we are allowed full contact blocking). We'll also run a QB keeper to the opposite side with one of my speedy players if the defense over commits to the WR. As we put this together, I was shocked how quick my guys were able to follow even this radical change to our formation. I believe it was due to COLOR CODING the positions. It made things very simple for them ("OK coach I am brown and block for blue as he runs").

Any new advice on scripting plays? 5 plays to start each half (and letting the kids know in advance) seemed to work pretty well for me - but the second half plan went haywire in our first game as they defense made adjustments. Hopefully throwing a new formation out there to start the 2H will be the wrinkle that really opens up our offense.

[Johnp2]

There is some talking going on in the huddle. I try to limit it to just me but there is always talk. Can I get the ball on this play? Etc. I'll try and limit that to just me going forward - starting with practice.

I can feel your pain. We had a lot of issues with that at first last season as well. Below is what I did, for what it's worth. By the middle of the season it was no longer an issue:

1. Explain NO TALKING in the huddle. The key word is "explain". We had a long talk about how it will "hurt our team and cost us to lose", etc. if they talk.

2. Have the players enforce the rule as well. In other words, once the kids knew not to talk, some will still do it---these are boys after all. In practice, what I would do is just stop in mid-sentence when someone was talking. That player of course would not even notice (as he was not paying attention). The other kids would look at me and I would just give the quite signal and keep looking at the talking player(s). Of course the talkers would realize pretty soon that everyone in the huddle was just starting at them. When they stopped I would look at the rest of the team and say, "Now what was Andrew and Michael doing wrong there?" After while, I noticed the kids started policing themselves.

3. Asking for the ball can be a serious issue if you don't nip it early. Make a hard-fast rule about it. If a player asked for the ball in a game, he knew I would sit him out a play. Honestly, I only had to do it one time. The player accepted his "punishment", we shook hands when he came back in the game and it was never an issue again.

I do think I may have a few to many plays for them at this early stage. However, I want to have the ability to run several things. I've got to balance that and like I said, I may limit the plays we run until we get those down and then add on.

That is pretty much what I did. I think we rolled with about 20 plays last season no problem. However, a lot of them were just a variant of one another. Example is the end-around. I had one for each of my wide-outs (three of them). Same with the shuffle pass, I had one for each of my interior lineman. We went into our first game (after about 6-8 practices) knowing about 8 plays really well. Each practice I would add a few more as it was easier for them to learn once they had a baseline.

On the play calling - do you go through what EVERY player is doing on the play OR do you mainly concentrate on the responsibilities of the QB and the guys getting the ball?

This is where you will get a lot of different views, I'm sure. I give a player a primary position, and that is his to own. He is responsible for knowing all the plays at his position. I feel it's easier for one player to learn 20 different plays at his position, then to learn three plays at six different positions. The key is to ensure that you have plays designed for each position. This way your LG can get as many carries as the RB.

Now, regarding play-calling below is what I did:
Running Plays:
1. I'd call the play, and point out any subtlties.
2. Example for our RB Counter play, I would say, "RB Counter. Fake hand off-left. LG---pull. RB---make sure you cut hard. Everyone else be sure to block to your left."
3. Of course all the kids were familiar with the play and knew precisely what to do, but they needed little reminders like that. After a while you will know which kids need extra reminders.

Passing Plays:
Passing plays is where I learned it takes a little more patience. We had about 10 passing plays, and about half of them knew their routes on each of those plays, but that means half didn't. So . . . we spent a LOT of time in practice knowing each of our routes. This way I could:
1. Call the play, and go around the huddle calling out each position route.
2. Example: "Cygnux X-1. LG post. LR short in. C medium out. RG flag. MR slant. RR curl. RB wheel."
3. This way, assuming everyone is paying attention and knows each route, they just go out an execute.
4. I also had some players forget their route by the time they got to the LOS (mainly Kindergartners). Consequently, I asked them if they have trouble remembering their route from the huddle to the LOS, to just repeat their route to themselves the entire time. It seemed to work.

I hope this helps some. What you describe (huddle-chatter, slow play-calling) is something that I had to deal with early in my first season, so this is what I did and it really did turn it around to where we became one of the fastest teams to call our plays.

[CoachScott]

I think playing 8 quarterbacks in one game is a HUGE mistake. If I were you, I'd stick to your best 2 and rotate in 1-2 others for some handoffs and such. I understand what you're trying to do, work in all the players but you still need to have a chance to win.

That would make things a lot easier for me. I'll have to run that by our league director, the rules state that every kid plays every position. Doesn't really say you have to do that every single game though.

How'd you deal with parents thinking their kid should/could play QB?

I don't agree with playing just one or two QBs at this age. In our league, our QB can only handoff or pass - they cant run - so in situations where my rotation puts a QB in that does not have strong pass skills, besides run plays I have a couple plays where we hand off to a RB or WR in the slot and then he becomes the QB. This gets the kid who is not a strong passer some experience at QB and helps build up his confidence. I am a big advocate of rotating all my players in all positions. Another note on rotations that has worked well for us, I have 10 players and I set up 2 squads per game. Then a squad goes out for 1 offensive set and one defensive set (or 1 D and one O depending on who won the toss) and then they come off the field. So it doesn't matter how many plays are in that series of offense and defense. It keeps one group of kids together for the game, and then they rotate positions within that squad. Also, in our league they make it a point that it isnt about winning. Of course we try to win, but I don't change my rotation based on situations. Our plays have enough options that if I have a weaker kid in at QB I can get the ball to a stronger kid just the same.

[Coach Rob]

I don't agree with playing just one or two QBs at this age. In our league, our QB can only handoff or pass - they cant run - so in situations where my rotation puts a QB in that does not have strong pass skills, besides run plays I have a couple plays where we hand off to a RB or WR in the slot and then he becomes the QB. This gets the kid who is not a strong passer some experience at QB and helps build up his confidence. I am a big advocate of rotating all my players in all positions.

I, too, have other players who "act as a QB" on a flea flicker type play, or QB sneak or even straight handoffs, but the main reason I only use a few at QB is ball touches. My successful ball touches per kid has increased significantly by stablizing the QB position. Fewer dropped passes, fewer fumbles on handoffs and pitches which has created more opportunities for all the kids to have a successful turn at offense.

The other reason I like having 1 or 2 main QBs is they allow our misdirection plays to work. Again, this gives players who might not be the best runners a chance at gaining more yards or even a td, which is more fun for than a bad exchange or trying to catch a bad pass. When I have kids who aren't real confident at playing QB, they can usually just do a straight handoff or maybe a short pass. Nothing wrong with that, however, it usually results in someone's flag being pulled pretty quickly though or a fumble. With 11 kids, it takes a lot of effort to make sure they all get 2-3 ball touches per game, having a few solid QBs helps that tremendously. I weighed the impact of having more kids learning how to play QB vs increasing ball touches and opted for the ball touch route. If I had more than an hour to practice each week, I'd probably consider trying to develop more QBs.

CRob

[Johnp2]

I agree, Rob. I personally don't think you are "slighting" any of the players by not allowing them to play QB (or their preferred position, for that matter). I don't see how putting a player who does not posess passing skills in at QB just so he hands-off to other players gives him much confidence. Instead, I like to work toward the players' strengths.

As an example, last season I had a player (a Kindergartner) I put at Center the first practice. It was evident right off the bat he could not snap the ball. He struggled mightly with it. I think he made like one out of probably 30+ snaps. However, I noticed he was deceptively fast. After that practice I told his parents I was moving him out of Center. The reason was I did not want to put him in a situation where he would completely embarrass himself during a game. It had nothing to do with wins and losses. I'm sure if I worked with him all season he would have gotten it down, but it was something he simply was not comfortable with. Of course, he scored TDs for us in the position I ultimately put him at---so it worked out well.

I feel that if your playbook allows everyone to get equal touches, and you allow the players to focus on a specific position so that he can excel at that position, you can add more, complex plays to your playbook and allow the kids to really shine. Last season we had three practices per week, and even with that I am unsure how I could teach each kid how to learn each responsibility on each play (unless I had a very vanilla playbook, or told the kids "just go out for a pass"). Instead the kids developed quite a bit of chemistry by playing in the same position, and they all knew their position was just as important as any other position on the field.

As for substitutions, I go by quarter. Last season I had 11 kids and we play 8 on 8. While not every player got equal playing time in each game (do the math), I was able to ensure they got equal playing time on the season as a whole. I would set the lineups before each game and email them to the parents so they knew which quarters their child was playing.